OmahaBeach

Anything about UT2004 mapping, Uscripting & more
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Cat1981England
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Cat1981England » Fri 1. May 2015, 19:19

Yeah they're linked to nodes 5/6 using the ForcedClosedActor Tag.
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Pegasus
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Pegasus » Fri 1. May 2015, 20:04

Among the issues discussed in a quick chat I had with Cat about the latest OmahaBeach was also the fact that the core-to-core paths its Node Link Setup allows players to choose from all require flipping no less than 5 nodes, which, on a roster/cross-map average, is a pretty high minimum - possibly the highest! Cat asked me what alternative NLS[es] I might have to propose, and after giving it some thought, here's what I came up with, also consistent with my conviction that even this edit remains overflowing and top-heavy in nodes and that, therefore, it too could stand to lose some more nodes with possible further uncluttering/beneficial impact to gameplay:

Image

I don't have too much writing time today, but I'm gonna try to address a few more points below:

On the issue of "upgrading" the existing superweapons budget,
Maniac wrote:I suggest the EONS Nuke (the faster and stronger one, like at SpankJox). Both can get a node destroyed in one hit, but a normal nuke is too slow - the desired target node is usually locked when your nuke arrives there. The SpiderMine Nuke could do, too - combined with a Raptor, it's a mighty tool to get some distant node down fast.[...]
The custom nuke SpankJox features is the WGS Nuke and I think it's far from a sensible choice for a number of reasons I've gone over previously in this post. Also, options such as that would have a significantly more gameflow-stunting impact than the one you're criticizing the standard redeemer for, considering the latter clears an area and allows a new status quo to shape around a contested objective in under 2secs, while the WGS nuke demands an almost fivefold timespan to conclude its gratuitous and frustrating mayhem. If taking down nodes is what you're after, IMO the standard nuke remains the quickest n' most elegant fit.

Maniac wrote:[...][The Raptors at n3] Are totally OK. Having them there, you can get back to the battlefield extremely fast and have a chance to destroy the enemy node 3 is linked to. Mantas suck at climbing the hills and surviving afterwards, and Benders are of little use there. E.g., I've seen 2 Benders + 1 pedestrian owned by 1 Falcon there.[...]
First off (and funnily enough, too), raptors would probably be one of the worst vehicle choices for raiding the enemy garage corner node, seeing as you can barely get close enough to it and you'd be exposed to threats you wouldn't even be able to see once you'd start attacking it. More importantly and in a bigger picture sense though, by the time a match in this latest edit transitions to late-game, the defending team would have to contend with a quite worrying array of enemy flyers from almost every direction while trying to reclaim its primaries: 3 enemy flyers from the enemy core (one of 'em pretty strong n' nimble too), 2 cicadas from the corner garage nodes (possibly with co-pilots), a massive dragon bombing and pushing back any defensive attempts by air and, finally, 2 additional raptors from the beach node that are only 2-3 measly seconds away from the enemy core and can keep staging attacks from there. Dunno about you, but this flyer budget sounds like overkill to me, and that's why I proposed the beach node's role as a whole stop functioning as that of a (very) forward air base, and instead be changed to something equally useful, but more suited to a different playstyle/approach. Said node always featured at least one vec to be used in a defensive role, and I think there's room to examine whether that should be a pally variant for node shielding or a bender variant for anti-air; either way, the mantas would still offer speed and agility to hopeful core raiders (plus the ability to move more than one player at a time), only not the same type of safety that hovering behind the enemy base and slipping plasma shots through the slits that the 2 raptors enjoy. And yes, having to negotiate the barbed wires before attacking a vulnerable core is also an intentional part of the equation, given the rest of the situational advantages the attackers would be enjoying.
A different role for the beach node would be as a (also more theme-fitting) staging ground for land armoured attacks against the enemy core and above-ground primary, much like the map was redesigned to accommodate - what with all the newly placed rear fortifications and defenses - but so far had failed to deliver. In fact, and to take that concept to its logical conclusion, one could see each of the midsection nodes designed to serve a completely different function for their owners, namely the beach one delivering strong reinforcements to pound the enemy from the ground (albeit after an uphill battle straight through or round-about through their own core first), the central one as a repair outpost for all offensive forces, and the northern one as offering mild assistance so the attackers can reach and tear down the enemy garage node. Only changes that would require would be axing the dragon (already too strong a vec if it's only provided to the stronger team and only 5-6secs away from the enemy core), blocking the beach node-proximal uphill access paths to each base, and wisely picking the type of tanks to give the beach node's holders (i.e. nothing that could be able to repeatedly spawnkill through splash damage the enemy base's top level such as ions, PPCs, SPMAs or deployable levi variants; linear shooters and, uniquely enough, Wormbo's Perses would be the better choices). Just find and stick a couple o' landing (hover)craft st.meshes with their gates dropped down by the shore and you should be golden :).

Lastly, I stand by my expectation that the types of scorp variants thrown in this latest edit won't be of much use, especially in light of the additional resource baggage they require, and, instead, seem to've been thrown in just for flair's sake. Minigun scorp in particular has no staying power (any kinda half-serious impact or a headshot can kill the driver; remember, folks, most scorp variants are death traps!) and might more prudently/simply be replaced by a well placed badger (which spawns next door already!). Given the makeup of the enemy raiding forces they're expected to defend against, the garage nodes' players might care more for a multi-purpose, mid-tier solution like a Cobra than the Railtank too, I expect.


Anyway, there's obviously more one could talk about with a map as packed as this, but that's all I had time for now. Hope some of it helped.
Image

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Maniac
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Maniac » Fri 1. May 2015, 20:51

You must be right about the Deemers. Giving it a second thought, you still can take it and launch it from one of the other friendly nodes, so speed is not the issue. My bad.

I like the idea of swapping node 3 to the armoured vehicles node role. I find the idea of putting the Perses on the beach great! This will make the node 3 "high stakes" one - the vehicle is easy to notice and destroy, but if the team fails to do it for some reason, the consequences are dire... And there is no need for Raptors there, too.

About the Scorpions - I'm not convinced and will advocate them again :). I see their role as one of the hoverboard from UT3 - they give you the speed and some weapon to irritate your enemies. As a bonus, each variation has its unique positive side, which can be fully used on this particular map. The link scorp works great as a mobile healer (I've used it on the nearby Goliath, which can be downed pretty fast by constant flow of the on-foot players - they still can shoot a rocket or two before dying); the EONS scorp allows to break a node entrance spam blockade - a distraction to get behind the attackers and let your teammates to get into good positions; the minigun scorp is great as a skirmisher - even with its small damage, it still has decent range and can get some on-foot players killed, block a node from spawning, damage the flying vehicles or, at least, serve as a distracting target for enemy heavies.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that all these features add more tactical tools to the gameplay than an additional Badger or two.

[P]etya

Re: OmahaBeach

Postby [P]etya » Sat 2. May 2015, 13:24

I like the current version of the map very much, but there is a thing which I noticed:
Alligator's respawn time is way too long. Alligator isn't Minotaur so it can't kill everything very easily also its weapon is only useful at close or medium range combat. It can lose to Railgun Tanks, Ion Tanks and normal tanks very easily. Even if you don't plan to replace it with something more powerful, it is considerable that you should decrease the respawn time so it can be used more frequently.

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Cat1981England
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Cat1981England » Sat 9. May 2015, 15:02

Sorry this is late and the confusing map naming.

ONS-OmahaBeach-)o(-V3-Beta5

- Node names adjusted for new link setup.
- Four kactor paving stones changed to static meshes.
- Collision volume placed in ship.
- Placed no vehicle entry at top of primary shafts.
- Un-hid pickup bases apart from primary node health pickups.
- Fixed 4 floating minigun turrets.
- Moved n1 minigun turrets away from edge.
- Adjusted the scaling of the dark soil so it doesn't look too patchy from the air.
- Replaced minigun scopion from n4/7 with EONS Scopion.
- Removed EONS Scopion from n5/6.
- Replaced 1 Raptor with Assault Hellbender at n3.
- Adjusted Static Mesh Cull distance as thing were still popping into view particularly in the Falcon.
- Lowed Alligator's respawn time down slightly.

Although the Raptors cannot directly attack nodes 4/7 they offer the quickest way of getting there. Apart from the Ion Tank and possibly a Manta there isn't much that can attack that node.

I'm not conviced by the proposed link setups. I've tried them with bots and they all seem to end in a stalemate and with people I think this would be even worse. I do understand the argument that having to flip 5 nodes to reach the other team core is a lot but it does seem to be working atm with our current vehicle layout. The flyers and Mantas take advantage of the more isolated nodes (13, 4, 3, 7 and 8) and have helped in comebacks several times now, while the heavier vehicles are drawn towards the centre of the map and make 12 and 9 key tactical nodes.
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Cat1981England
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Cat1981England » Mon 18. May 2015, 20:25

ONS-OmahaBeach-)o(-V3-C-SP1 is now on the server.

Unless some major bug is found I won't be editing this map again.
The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1:

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

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Dalyup!
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Dalyup! » Tue 3. Jan 2017, 22:55

Came across an interesting bug today. Ema is invisible underwater at certain angles. If she sticks out of the water, whatever is sticking out will be visible.

Image
Image

Not sure if map related or due to the game's engine or maybe even my graphics card.
Image

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Cat1981England
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Cat1981England » Wed 4. Jan 2017, 21:00

I think i used the default glass texture. I'll make a shader texture tomorrow to fix it.

Any other issues while i've got it open in the editor?
The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 1:

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

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Dalyup!
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby Dalyup! » Wed 4. Jan 2017, 22:57

[s]The map exists.[/s] [s]The falcon.[/s] [s]The dragon.[/s] Nothing else I noticed.
Image

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smalltown
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Re: OmahaBeach

Postby smalltown » Thu 5. Jan 2017, 16:34

the trees near node 8 and node 11 too many of them got stuck many times in there with any air vehicle..../
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