Stonegate

Server setup, history & future
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Cat1981England
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Stonegate

Postby Cat1981England » Tue 10. Jan 2017, 21:51

Right then boys and girls. Some of you were unhappy last night about the removal of StoneWall, and as promised, here's a thread explaining why.... and a little bit extra.

The problem isn't with Stone itself, but when we have a "run" of a similar type of map. Basically what happens is that a couple of people will get a taste for (in this case) DM maps and along with a few others vote for, say.. SpaceCargo. Even though most people are willing to tolerate a single round of a map they don't like, a couple will leave and one or two DM'ers will join and the next map is almost guaranteed to be something like Stone. After 40/50 minutes of DM'ing, even people who like those maps will start to leave, but there's still enough people to vote for Rail. Same thing happens again and we play Foundry, then Playground, then Pandemonium or Spank or BBB etc At the end of all of this, it's 9.30 at night when the server should be full - there are 3 people on and someone will ask "why is it so quiet tonight?" For those of you that have asked that question, there's your answer ;)

I have done this many, many times now and normally people don't notice. If Playground has already been voted for and Stone isn't available, after that first ultra-popular SpaceCargo has been voted for there's less chance of this "run" starting. Once i'm happy that the map voting is back to normal, Stone will be put back on the roster. Sometime this can be done in just a couple of days, other times it takes a week.

Usually we quieten down before and during Christmas, but pick up again mid-January, so i would like this to go back on asap. Either way, don't worry, it'll be back on soon :thumbup:

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It isn't just the DM maps that do this, the Tank maps had the same problem in the past and it got so bad at one point that Heinz (and OMNI) created new servers just for specific types of maps. We've learnt our lesson and won't let it happen again. CEONSS will continue to have a wide range of maps and as soon as a particular style of map becomes too dominate something will be done to stop that because it hurts the server. We keep a very careful eye on everything from the average number of players on each map, to the average round time, to the affect a map(s) have on player voting etc to do this.

The good new is that we are benefiting from all of this. Over the last couple of years our player base has grown while just about every other server has lost players. We've got more editors then ever before and the roster is being improved map by map. This means a more stable server, better performance, quicker downloads, a greater diversity of maps being played (which we all benefit from) and also more well rounded maps. As an example, you DM-monkeys can now play a role on Minus with most of the nodes inside buildings, various pickups, teleporters and a subway, while the skilful and noble vehicle players play ONS :p (It's actually quite fun not using any vehicles on Minus now).

The plan at the moment is to get the roster up to 79 maps, have one space open for the zombie map and to increase the map repeat rate up to 30. At the same time some maps such as the ultra-spam will continue to be rotated to keep things interesting. Just last night while one or two of you were having a whine, i took a quick look at the available maps. Tyrant, MasterShower, Minus, Storage, Dria, CaptainSors and BBB are just the ones i can remember. Big maps, small maps, DM, heavy vehicles all available. We've got rebuilds, more new maps, much improved edits and some simple gameplay tweaks all being worked on by our team of (under appreciated) editors. It's all coming along nicely and we all benefit from this.

Ultimately the point is this. If you are reading this, you have chosen to play maps online with people rather then your favourite maps offline. If you want to play with people online you need to be willing to make a compromise because there isn't enough people (overall) left to have single style map servers, so every now and then you will see your favourite map removed. The good news is however, that there are more and more people playing at CEONSS, there are more and more quality maps for you to choose from and every other area of CEONSS is being improved, so cheer up :D
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Gaffer
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Re: Stonegate

Postby Gaffer » Wed 11. Jan 2017, 13:06

NOW WE RIO.... oh wait...that makes sense. Carry on.

P.S. Thanks to everyone working on improving the server, keep up the great work.
P.P.S. Fuck tanks and all those who tank

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widurr
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Re: Stonegate

Postby widurr » Wed 11. Jan 2017, 13:41

yea, it makes sense, but it was one of my favourites :( I'm not going to hyde that I'm more of a DM-style map fan.
I'd rather see Foundry or even SpaceCargo go.

About ppl leaving after 40-50 minutes of DM maps... that's just 2 games. Each of us have some maps we don't like. Spectate for 25 minutes (1 map) is not that big of a deal. I've done it myself multiple times.

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smalltown
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Re: Stonegate

Postby smalltown » Wed 11. Jan 2017, 15:15

widurr wrote: Spectate for 25 minutes .


time is priceless no arguement. Will always hate dm maps no matter what. Am not at all happy with the return of stone and rail. Anything ons even with the weirdest vehicles setup is better than dm shit smh...
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lichReen
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Re: Stonegate

Postby lichReen » Thu 12. Jan 2017, 02:14

I understand that this may not be attractive to some. I just like close in fighting. I think it's good to always have a mix. I cannot think of another server that has such hand-to-hand intense combat that revolves around capturing nodes by sheer force of will. It is an awesome tactical battle, not just some slug-fest. It involves outwitting the enemy, by going behind enemy lines to outflank them, to find routes/jumps/paths that can lead you to finding the enemy's weak spot or particular node that isn't guarded. Or by timing an attack just as one node becomes available so you can blitzkrieg the enemy, or sniping to keep control of a chokepoint. There are the traditional fighting lines, i.e. left flank, centre and right-flank. All of this is thought of during the fighting, and I don't want to sound snobbish, but anyone who can't see that certain tactics are being used, and changing on-the-fly obviously can't comprehend how victories are won in a toe to toe match-up.

Never the less, as long as a good balance is somehow able to be present, where everyone can get their fill, I say, do what's best for the server. I say again, no other server is like this one. It's not quite DM'ing as one might say, it's more exciting than that. You're actually fighting with an objective at hand. It may just be, but to stop a certain group of enemy opponents from reigning supreme with a tank, or the high ground, or air attack, or deemer control is of great satisfaction (especially those who think they can just keep exploiting a weakness without someone meeting them with equal force *cough cough* i.e. tank whores) . A lot of this is thought of during the combat. So I hope the stigma of the mindless blood thirsty DM player doesn't hold water, if not but for a joke every now and then.

Do what's best for the server. In time, these problems can be fixed with everyone being catered for.

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-Nick-
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Re: Stonegate

Postby -Nick- » Fri 13. Jan 2017, 23:18

lichReen wrote: It's not quite DM'ing as one might say

lichReen wrote:You're actually fighting with an objective at hand


Agreed.

Nothing to do with not useing vehicles or not likeing vehicles in my opinion. A proper DM player will completely disregard destroying or constructing a node just to shoot at players, even jump out of vehicles if they see a particular player or a large group. I've even seen it mid constructing when the enemy is miles away, then i and who ever else will get over ridden cause half the team we were with constructing has ran off chasing people. A stereotype of a DM player is that they are good at killing people and for some reason whilst playing ONS that's regarded as a DM style of play, load of crap. It's only when they don't play the objective that's the case and let's face it alot of players regardless of 'DM' skill do not play the objective. There's only a handful good killers who are good ONS players, at least to what i regard as a ONS player and you do not have to be a good killer or use vehicles to be a great ONS player. In my opinion a player who is fantasic at killing people but completely disregards the objective is the worse type of player and i'de trade them for any one who plays the objective regardless of skill. I've had some jip over the years for my play style, people will lable me as a DM player or as some one who 'only joins NV maps' utter rubbish in my opinion and i think people who say things like that to anyone should look at what type of 'ONS' player they are, then talk.

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Gaffer
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Re: Stonegate

Postby Gaffer » Sat 14. Jan 2017, 12:03

I concur with the previous two, I won't repeat what they've said other than NV maps can be really tactical and that if you aren't constantly paying attention to which nodes to take then you're doing it wrong.
I would like to raise an additional point though, I feel that most of the current NV maps aren't all that good. VK's playground is by far the best as there really aren't any narrow passages where fighting is common where spam becomes an issue. This teamed with a very good node link setup makes it a fantastic map. Stonewall has too many narrow choke-points and despite there being a few ways to get nodes behind enemy lines, the overall narrowness on the map makes it feel restrictive. It's also spam hell.
Bridge of Fate has promising features such as the wide side corridors and the massive halls which can reduce outright spam, but the middle nodes really let the map down.
Foundry is pretty good, but i'd like it to have LG.
Basically, Playground gets it right and I wouldn't mind the others being removed if it meant we got wider NV maps with interesting node links.

Edit: Rail is fun but also narrow, so gameplay suffers when the server is full.

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smalltown
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Re: Stonegate

Postby smalltown » Sat 14. Jan 2017, 12:42

Gaffer wrote:Bridge of Fate has promising features such as the wide side corridors and the massive halls which can reduce outright spam, but the middle nodes really let the map down.
Basically, Playground gets it right and I wouldn't mind the others being removed if it meant we got wider NV maps with interesting node links.


Agree on that one. The Middle nodes are like a paradise for bio spam and flak.
VK playground is balanced in some ways. Need more new NV maps....
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-Nick-
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Re: Stonegate

Postby -Nick- » Sat 14. Jan 2017, 13:02

Gaffer wrote:NV maps can be really tactical and that if you aren't constantly paying attention to which nodes to take then you're doing it wrong.


Definitely, but most don't showcase this. The worst at the moment for me is Jailbreak and Spacecargo. I'll happily be in spec most the time.

As for the maps i personally am not bothered what gets removed because i know it's for a good reason(s) as cat has explained and also i know that it would be replaced with something with standard and/or edited with such. I asked that very question in-game at around 10:00 on a saturday when there was like 6 people online and had no idea that could have been from a consistant rotation of certain maps. Pretty cool the extent of what infomation is garthered and how it's used to benefit us players.

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Gaffer
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Re: Stonegate

Postby Gaffer » Sat 14. Jan 2017, 14:23

:|
-Nick- wrote:The worst at the moment for me is Jailbreak and Spacecargo. I'll happily be in spec most the time.

Pretty cool the extent of what infomation is garthered and how it's used to benefit us players.


I agree about Jailbreak; every time I play that map I never have time to take duels, its just constant node destroy, node build, node destroy, node... I end up with 200+ scores with only 20 kills.

Spacecargo is a bit better in that sense, there is still room for manoeuvring and there are ways to get behind the enemy so i'm not opposed to that map. As a map that exists just for laughs, it's good in my books.


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