CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

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EmanReleipS
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by EmanReleipS » Mon 9. Sep 2019, 22:58

Hi peeps,

This month marks the 10 year anniversary of our server. :partyyy:
This server has brought people together both online and offline. Throughout the years, we have tried to create a place where everyone can feel welcome and have a fun time. Now it's been 10 years since this server was started by LaborHeinz, the Original Boss, as well as 15 years since the game's release.

To celebrate this occasion, we would like to invite you all to a series of special events.

First, we will organize another Lan party (if there are enough participants). Please sign up in the topic if you are interested. We will also be hosting another match event, and release new edits/maps. At the same time, I will be streaming some games on the server to show more people that our game is still going strong. Due to Real Life, we would like to start the special events next month. We'd be very happy if many of you would start to wear a [CEONSS] tag. This is not a clan symbol, but rather intended for everyone who enjoys playing on this server. :thumbup:

Here is the schedule so far:

- October 10th - October 13th: Lan Party
- October 15th: Start wearing [CEONSS] tags
- October 19th/20th: Match event including new edits
- October 20th: New edits go live on the server (unless we find out at the match event that they are broken)
- October 27th - Nov 3rd: Classic Map Week (i.e. original Torlan, Crossfire, Artic edits)
- November 10th: End of celebration

- Stream schedule (tentative): Oct 15th, Oct 19th, Oct 23rd, Oct 26th, Oct 30th, Nov 2nd, Nov 6th, Nov 10th

I'm very proud of this server and I would like to thank all the admins and players for their part in making this a great place! Also, a big thanks to Heinzi and Cat, who brought us this far with their vision and hard work. Here's to many more years together! :cheers:
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by Ten » Tue 10. Sep 2019, 17:06

:thumbup:

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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by Hawk » Tue 10. Sep 2019, 19:15

Tags starting on the 15th October ?? Great coincidence cause thats my birthday lol.
Its been a wonderfull time so far on this server and I hope the server lasts many many years more.
Lots of Thx indeed to Heinz in the first place for starting this server and thx to all the admins that continued it. And ofcourse lots of thx to the 2 bosses after Heinz : Cat and now Emans. And many thx to everybody I had the pleasure of gaming with all these years, you all gave me a lot of laughter and fun on this server.

Greetings to all
Hawk
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EmanReleipS
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by EmanReleipS » Tue 10. Sep 2019, 19:57

Hawk wrote:
Tue 10. Sep 2019, 19:15
Tags starting on the 15th October ?? Great coincidence cause thats my birthday lol.
Its been a wonderfull time so far on this server and I hope the server lasts many many years more.
Lots of Thx indeed to Heinz in the first place for starting this server and thx to all the admins that continued it. And ofcourse lots of thx to the 2 bosses after Heinz : Cat and now Emans. And many thx to everybody I had the pleasure of gaming with all these years, you all gave me a lot of laughter and fun on this server.

Greetings to all
Hawk
Great timing! It is my mum's birthday and my anniversary as server owner as well. :D

I hope we will see you on the server again soon, Hawky! We miss you a lot!
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by Miauz55555 » Thu 12. Sep 2019, 19:28

:happybday: ......... CEONSS
And we now have an https://www.instagram.com/www_ceonss_net/ account. =D
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by Pegasus » Thu 24. Oct 2019, 09:01

So with the LAN Party and the Match Event wrapped up, the server now ready to get into the more public, roster-based part of the celebrations, and me just done with a busy few weeks, with a hefty map review behind me and some (expected) quiet time for the upcoming weeks, I'd be a waste to not take this opportune time and propose some ideas I've had for awhile about the rest of CEONSS' 10-year anniversary festivities, see what everyone thinks of 'em.

First off, let's talk dates. Specifically, game-significant landmark dates for us in 2019. We already observed UT2004 completing 15 years since launch in mid-March and are in the process of celebrating the bigger milestone of this server and community turning 10 these days. But there's yet another date coming up to keep in mind: as we know, the UT franchise started with UT99, and that game, as a recent article reminded me, was first launched on Nov. 23rd, 1999 in the Americas, and a few days later on this side of the pond.
Even though that might stretch the pre-planned schedule presented at the top of this thread, I'd like to propose that we extend the remaining parts of the celebration by 2 more weeks so as to conclude the entire fest on the final, decimally significant date of the year for the game and go out with a bang, so to speak, ringing in the third decade of UT by wearing our [20YRsUT] or [UT@20] tags. It would also provide more time to maybe do a few extra promotional/streaming activities and outreach attempts over the YouTubes n' Twitters and all those other gaming/social venues that might hit fresh eyes and attract 'em to the server. More importantly though, it would afford us the room to try a few more things around the concept of the roster-based changes discussed above, which just so happens to be the next topic I wanna get into below.

For most, a description that starts with "Classic Map Week (i.e. original Torlan, Crossfire, ...)" as a sampling of themed roster changes to follow might garner an indifferent "oh, okay" kind of reaction. Mine was a more on the concerned side for a couple of reasons. First, Torlan excluded, many of the stock, original ONS maps had the tendency to contain only one primary (a few had a second, stub primary leading nowhere) and/or to include a chokepoint node in their Node Link Setup (NLS), both of which I've repeatedly decried in the past on this msg.board as deeply problematic practices (example here).
The problem has to do with the core of the ONS metagame - strategic territory control through skill and teamwork - which itself requires the presence of meaningful choice in where to go and how to fight next until you reach the enemy core. When it comes to original maps and the aforementioned kinds of link setups, however, what instead happens is that ONS break downs around such single primary or chokepoint nodes, since the only choice for either team is to just keep butting heads around the area with no alternative, reducing the gametype to a DOM variant with vehicles, where one team keeps controlling and spawning at A, the other at C, and they're both trying to grab B. (This is also why "pearls on a string" series of degree-2 nodes in an NLS is a bad practice, btw, even for maps with >=2 primaries.) One choice in where to go next is zero meaningful choice. Zero meaningful choice is not ONS.
"But, Peg", you might say, "aren't you laying this a little thick n' dramatic?" Well, UT2004's stock maps are ArcticStronghold, Crossfire, Dawn, Dria, FrostBite, Primeval, RedPlanet, Severance, and Torlan, and then there's four more in the ECE, namely Adara, IslandHop, Tricky, and Urban. Wanna know how many of them are not affected by these issues when considering their default (or most, or even all alternatives) link setup? Dawn and Torlan. That's the whole list. Ten others have only one primary in their default NLS, and 7 also contain a chokepoint node as well. With those numbers in mind, I think this is an important point to emphasize and raise awareness about.
Giving ourselves a week or more to revisit older content can certainly have value, but IMO not more value than what I believe the server's mission statement to still be, i.e. to be a place to play actual ONS, not some other gametype pretending to be that in name only, even during those weeks. In other words, some care should be taken that the selected "classic" content still adhere to the ONS gametype, or that it be minimally modified to adhere to it, if there's no alternative NLS available to address the issue, and that, invariably, a benchmark should be enforced where maps must have at least 2 primaries and link setups without unavoidable chokepoint [central] nodes. Shouldn't really prevent anyone from experiencing all the annoying "vintage" ONS design standards, while still ensuring the free time we're spending on the server 15 years later is still to play actual ONS.
The other reason this list of original maps bugs me is because, presumably, the theme of the intended roster changes will be one of retrospection. Players will be able to re-experience older content, hopefully sparking subsequent reflection and conversation regarding how ideas, standards n' policies evolved, which directions taken worked better or which ones didn't. To my mind, there's no reason why that examination shouldn't involve all of the gametype's past 15 years' worth of notable content and all of CEONSS' 10-years-long history of evaluation, adaptation, curation of and contribution to that pool of user-generated content. Why limit the scope only to Epic-bundled maps that came out in 2004-2005, when our ONS experiences have been shaped by so many other successful, characteristic - emblematic of the gametype even - works that were created or refined between then and now? It'd be a shame to crack open that proverbial old book, but only to go as far as the first chapter and then stop as if we've relived the full story.
Fortunately, the fix for such a concern is pretty straightforward: simply try to be a bit bolder and broaden our horizons to the kind of classic content we can add to the roster during the retrospective of the server's 10 years in the "ONS life", always ensuring, of course, it's maps the server has hosted before and that we considered good even by the older standards, instead of any old chaff. And if you're with me on that, well, I've got a pretty nostalgic and audacious list of concept/implementation swaps for you to check out right below :).

The main bundle:
- MinusTankMeUp-CEONSS-v1 -> MinusTankMeUp-)o(-Gorz-BigAl
- MasterBath-C-SP1 -> MasterBath-Ren)o(vation-v2
- Gunshop-C-SP5-test1e -> D$K-Gunshop-SP1-32p
- Tyrant-C-SP1 -> Tyrant-)o(-Renovation-V1
- Nevermore-TankMeUp-RC1-SP2 -> Nevermore-ECE-T32
- DoubleSlap-V3 -> THI-TripleSlap-RC2 (the lowered ceiling, 4.7MB edit; not the 6MB, high ceiling homonym)
- CaptainSors_Island_of_Pwnage_C -> CaptainGordons_Box_of_Pwnage_RC1
- SpankJox-C -> SpaceJox-SP2
- LegoFort-C-SP1 -> BlockFort-V5
- Tropic-32p -> TropicNightfall-32p

Looser fits, based on map size and mix of dominant playstyles:
- BridgeOfFate_Blame_P_Again_C -> Katharos_NV_Blame_P_beta4b
- AbandonedCity-SedV3-C -> ONS-Acerbus-)o(-Danno-V7-Edit6

Additional bundle of tried n' tested content you can also swap with more recent maps for the roster retrospective, if you want:
- KAKMO[UPC]-32p-Beta2-NNC
- Ascendancy-T32-beta3 (or Ascendancy-BadWolf-V1c)
- Bittersands
- Crossfire32-R7
- Dawn-t32-Beta3
- Pyroclastic-R3
- Tek-32p-beta2-3-K2
- StormyWeather

And on Halloween night, we let the real monsters n' zombies roam:
- IMPULZE-V3-C-beta3 -> SPAMBOX-Revisited
- SpaceCargo-C-beta9 -> {IGS}-Grendelkeep-SP5
- CanyonDuel-C-sp2-beta5 -> CataldiPark-EONS-Edition-V1 (don't look at me like that, I said what I said!)

With some (or all) of the above swaps added to the mix, IMO it'd make our trip down memory lane more comprehensive n' exciting, updating the rest of the schedule like this:
- October 27th - Nov 23rd: Original Maps + Beloved Community Classics + Misc Good Oldies + Resurrected, Cursed Abominations :p
- November 23rd: Observation of UT99's 20-Year Anniversary and end of celebrations
Two more related things to quickly mention here. One, as always, if you do decide on this scope expansion, but are missing any of the above maps (or their dependencies) and can't find 'em anywhere else, just tell me what you need and I'll bundle it up for you.
Two, it's kinda unavoidable that some casual ingame visitors might not realize the server will be in a retro funk and might perceive the vast difference in gameplay/design standards from one classic map that's, say, community-made and well- kitted out to another stock classic, where individual weapon hunting might be required after respawning before one even start fighting, as too jarring.
With that in mind, there might be some sense in considering adding some kinda "minimum quality" safety net to the all maps before throwing 'em in the pool, by way of micro-editing them. This would be limited only to replacing stock, lackluster lockers with their custom n' properly stocked equivalent (mine layer exceptions would apply) so people won't have to keep throwing away their low-ammo linkguns, and incorporating OnslaughtSpecials2[_RNH] to offer link beam catching and node health display on radars. Beyond that, each old map would be left to "speak" for itself on its own merits, by way of its own design decisions and mix of unique gameplay elements.
Like I said at the top, I've got some free time, so if you give me the green light, I can get started on those at any point.


Lastly, something not directly related to the server's celebrations planning that seems to've been overlooked so far this year, but it's timely enough to raise these days. Since we're well into the spooky season of the year, how about we also throw Cat's Halloween edit into the roster?


Speaking of horrors, seems I've gotten back into the habit of assembling disturbingly long posts again. Bleh. Think I'll make the next one deliberately short, see if that scares it away. Anyway, do let me know what you think about all this, folks.
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by laboRHEinz » Thu 24. Oct 2019, 18:13

Pegasus wrote:
Thu 24. Oct 2019, 09:01
Additional bundle of tried n' tested content you can also swap with more recent maps for the roster retrospective, if you want:
- KAKMO[UPC]-32p-Beta2-NNC
- Ascendancy-T32-beta3 (or Ascendancy-BadWolf-V1c)
- Bittersands
- Crossfire32-R7
- Dawn-t32-Beta3
- Pyroclastic-R3
- Tek-32p-beta2-3-K2
- StormyWeather
Good idea!
Some more goodies :D :
  • ONS-AratheiaBeta6
  • ONS-DesertedSands-f2-32p
  • ONS-Glanum-ECE-T32-ZBeta2
  • ONS-theVine-T32-beta5

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EmanReleipS
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by EmanReleipS » Sat 26. Oct 2019, 12:13

This kind of discussion should have happened in June when I first suggested the celebration in the admin section, or even in early September, when I put dates to the proposed schedule, not three days before the proposed map changes. :nono:
I'd like to propose that we extend the remaining parts of the celebration by 2 more weeks so as to conclude the entire fest on the final, decimally significant date of the year for the game and go out with a bang, so to speak, ringing in the third decade of UT by wearing our [20YRsUT] or [UT@20] tags. It would also provide more time to maybe do a few extra promotional/streaming activities and outreach attempts over the YouTubes n' Twitters and all those other gaming/social venues that might hit fresh eyes and attract 'em to the server.
While I don't mind extending the celebration per se, I'm not gonna do that if the bulk of the promotional work continues to rest on my shoulders alone.
The other reason this list of original maps bugs me is because, presumably, the theme of the intended roster changes will be one of retrospection. Players will be able to re-experience older content, hopefully sparking subsequent reflection and conversation regarding how ideas, standards n' policies evolved, which directions taken worked better or which ones didn't.
I'm well-aware of the shortcomings of the vanilla maps. The idea behind adding them was that new players (attracted to our server via the promotional measures) would most likely actually be players who have played the game before, back in 2004-2006. They would be most familiar with the vanilla maps and those maps would provide a starting point from which they can discover our edits.
To my mind, there's no reason why that examination shouldn't involve all of the gametype's past 15 years' worth of notable content and all of CEONSS' 10-years-long history of evaluation, adaptation, curation of and contribution to that pool of user-generated content. Why limit the scope only to Epic-bundled maps that came out in 2004-2005, when our ONS experiences have been shaped by so many other successful, characteristic - emblematic of the gametype even - works that were created or refined between then and now? It'd be a shame to crack open that proverbial old book, but only to go as far as the first chapter and then stop as if we've relived the full story.
I think taking our players on a trip through memory lane when it comes to old edits would be difficult (I'm aware that you have suggested it before and I probably should have addressed it in detail then).

For one, as you said, most players will not realize what is going on. Even if I mention it in the RSS feed, I think no one except for Hydy will actually notice it. I think most casual players will not be interested in such subtleties and will be upset if their familiar, better edits are gone.

There is also the issue that I have only been on this server and active in the admin team for half of CEONSS' 10 year history. That means that I cannot provide the kind of insight or thoughtful commentary that might be needed.

What I think could work is to approach this on a smaller scope, in the context of a match event. Our players that participate in those events tend to be more deeply involved in the game. The addition of discord would also allow for in-depth discussion of the various older edits and what their shortcoming were. I would perhaps suggest to focus on two maps, and go through two or three different edits of each.

Either your presence during this, or at least a discussion beforehand between us on which points we want to illustrate, would be essential for this in my eyes.
With that in mind, there might be some sense in considering adding some kinda "minimum quality" safety net to the all maps before throwing 'em in the pool, by way of micro-editing them. This would be limited only to replacing stock, lackluster lockers with their custom n' properly stocked equivalent (mine layer exceptions would apply) so people won't have to keep throwing away their low-ammo linkguns, and incorporating OnslaughtSpecials2[_RNH] to offer link beam catching and node health display on radars.
If these maps are not going to remain on the roster in a more permanent fashion, I think it would be more beneficial to focus our energy on maps on our roster that could benefit from micro-edits. I suggested Adara, Ahebban and Icarus for edits before. Just going over their weapon lockers, exchanging scorpions with EONSS scorps, checking the location of spawn points (also in relation to the location of nearby weapon lockers and vehicles) and implementing the ONS_Specials would already be enough, I think.
Lastly, something not directly related to the server's celebrations planning that seems to've been overlooked so far this year, but it's timely enough to raise these days. Since we're well into the spooky season of the year, how about we also throw Cat's Halloween edit into the roster?
Good point. I forgot how late it already is. I will post in the admin section about the map switch.

By the way, I'm sorry that I haven't been able to stream yet. We took in a friend's two kittens/young cats while she is in vacation and they have been a bit much to deal with. One of them isn't handling the unfamiliar surroundings well and keeps pooping on the floor. They also have a habit of walking behind my PC case. Unfortunately my screen is connected via a VGA to HDMI adapter without any screws, and it falls out any time they walk past. This has been making gaming a little adventurous.
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by Pegasus » Sun 27. Oct 2019, 09:51

As a general principle, I don't think belabouring a point or doubling down makes an argument more convincing, so just in case some misunderstanding was caused from how I phrased my proposition, I'd like to qualify some crucial points.


Whenever I offer constructive feedback that requires time n' effort to implement, it's a matter of intellectual honesty to me to be ready to back my words with deeds, if need be. Under that belief and just in case my suggestions might be read by other already busy staffers as more work expected of them, I already offered to do most/all the micro-editing, which would only leave uploading the edited maps via FTP to the server, changing the .ini's maplist entries and restarting the server. All that could be done within a day or two, not requiring much pre-planning, which is where my thinking stood. Don't remember anyone discussing reviving batches of classic ONS maps back in June either (I'd have jumped at the chance), and, unfortunately, most of September is still a busy blur to me for personal reasons, so sorry about that last part. Tried to prioritize matters and lengthy replies once I got out of it in a way that would still make their timetables feasible, and I believe this applies here, too.

Pointing out that an extension to the celebration period would also afford more promotional opportunities was simply me trying to offer a potential tertiary benefit of my suggestion, should someone involved with that facet already be looking for ways to squeeze more out of it and were finding the current schedule constricting. Having no insight into that part of the celebrations though (never been involved with streaming or been active on social media), and therefore not being able to help there directly myself, I know better than to dictate to staffers handling that side of things to adapt a more stressful schedule on my account - and my respect for staffers here would also not let me pull such shit either. If anyone at all construed my previous suggestion as a request to do more on promotion, I'll outright state that's not the case, that wasn't my intention, and, even if it were, it wouldn't be a good enough reason for them to change their plans. That shit can be stressful on its own to get working right and I don't wish to add more on top of your/their pile.

About 100 people play on the server every day, and I figured there's more value in proposing something special that would affect all their ingame experience for days or weeks, possibly even helping some find an interest in constructive feedback or more, than a quickie for a dozen people already vocal enough and in close orbit to the server by way of frequent participation to past Match Events. You only get a 10-year celebration, well, once every ten years, so IMO everyone should have a chance to enjoy it and get something meaningful out of it.

Players getting confused by a sudden change of service habits can be a problem indeed, especially for newer ones, but for most, confusion is transient and how it's handled is what determines if a change will be problematic or not. Here, I strongly believe there's sufficient ways to mitigate this possible confusion, between our numerous helpful regulars offering a quick explanatory comment on the roster's partially altered composition, and a MOTD to the tune of "Classic ONS Maps Week #./Celebrate 10 years of CEONSS/by revisiting old ONS hits with us./For info and feedback go to ceonss.net" so as not needing to worry. For newer members that only played ONS up to 2006-ish, well, I imagine they'd be in for an adjustment period to all the later content, retro roster or otherwise.

Lastly, this plan needn't be seen as turning the server into an ONS museum for weeks on end, requiring dedicated staffers or spectating regulars to act as tour guides or walking encyclopedias of the entire ONS history, explaining how each area of each retro map evolved across edits while an actual match is unfolding in real-time before a live audience. Such a standard would indeed demand weeks or even months of preparation to research and execute properly, even by professional standards - think Half-Life 2: Lost Coast's developer commentary - and it wouldn't make sense to try for a small, UGC-based community like ours. When I said that each "old map would be left to 'speak' for itself", micro-update excluded, I meant that players would just be likely (or nudged) to reminisce about 'em ingame on their own, and we'd see where that might take us from there. Also, the micro-updates could be an on-ramping point for later work themselves, so it wouldn't be wasted work.
Oh, and, not for nothing, I'd wager your map savvy is in fine shape. Hell, if we wanna be strict about it, I doubt there's anyone that can rise to the standard of providing sufficient insight even into the dozen maps listed above these days by themselves, without even factoring in aging memory, what with each one having dozens of key factoids to recall. Which is exactly why administering is a team effort :).


Anyway, getting ranty again. The maps you mentioned at the end are all fertile ground too, btw, so lemme know how I can help, and I'll get on it.


PS:
EmanReleipS wrote:[...]By the way, I'm sorry that I haven't been able to stream yet. We took in a friend's two kittens/young cats while she is in vacation and they have been a bit much to deal with. One of them isn't handling the unfamiliar surroundings well and keeps pooping on the floor. They also have a habit of walking behind my PC case. Unfortunately my screen is connected via a VGA to HDMI adapter without any screws, and it falls out any time they walk past. This has been making gaming a little adventurous.
Pictures of said fuzzball saboturdteurs, if you please!
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CEONSS' 10 year anniversary

Post by EmanReleipS » Sun 27. Oct 2019, 20:32

I thought you wanted to have the micro-edited maps on the server instead of the planned classic map week, which is why I thought this would require more time.

Extending the celebration does make sense, but I doubt I will be able to keep the necessary energy up for that long. You may have noticed it already, but my energy (for anything from server work to map editing to art) tends to come in bursts. I can keep working on something for 10 hours without a break, then walk away from it for months, then dive into it again, rinse and repeat. I'm not so good at working on something continuously just a little bit here and there, or at a regular schedule. Well, apart from my actual job.

I figured you would want to get more peeps involved via the older maps, but I'm really afraid that it would be too much effort for too little gain. There are only a handful of people who reflect on this game as much as we do. Most players seem to just want some quick, casual ggs, which I understand.
Anyway, getting ranty again. The maps you mentioned at the end are all fertile ground too, btw, so lemme know how I can help, and I'll get on it.
Thanks! I believe you also enjoy Tropic. It could really benefit from full weapon lockers, maybe a couple more vehicles (or at least different vehicles at the bases). What do you think about micro-editing it?

In general for any micro-edits, I would like to see ONS_Specials implemented, full custom weapon lockers (although you may not want to include spider mines or sniper weapons at every locker), scorps replaced with EONS scorps or webcasters, merging health pickups if applicable, removing stray ammo pickups, checking the position of spawn points and adding more if necessary, and rebuilding with RGB8 lighting at the end. Oh, and +10 mantas to every map. ;)
That's all I can think of for now. Anything else that comes to your mind?

I'd advocate for focusing on our existing roster. But I would like to put Crossfire on it again, so I will take ONS-Crossfire32-R7 over to our roster discussion thread in the admin section. Also, I don't know what ONS-CataldiPark-EONS-Edition-V1is and I'm curious about it. I have ONS-CataldiPark, but not that particular edit. Could you bundle it up for me, please?
And on Halloween night, we let the real monsters n' zombies roam:
- IMPULZE-V3-C-beta3 -> SPAMBOX-Revisited
- SpaceCargo-C-beta9 -> {IGS}-Grendelkeep-SP5
Clearly you are in imposter! Bring the pitchforks! The Peg I know would never say this!

I like these ideas, though. For how long would you make this swap, just one day or maybe a long weekend (31st to 3rd)?

On an entirely unrelated note, lately my settings window in the editor has been broken. Any idea how to fix it?
Broken settings window.JPG
Cat tax:
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